That’s it. I’m calling it. Biden cannot win.

He needs to step aside. For the good of the country.

We can go with Harris, Whitmer, ptitzer. Doesn’t matter. Biden is too old and frail.

Jill needs to talk to him. Obama needs to talk to him.

If that’s the best he can do after days of debate prep . . .

That was really painful. I had to stop watching.

Biden looked old, extremely tired to the point of looking like he was going to keel over. Standing with his mouth agape while listening to the questions was a really bad look. Some of his responses (that I heard, like I said I had to tune out) were feeble and he jumbled his words. I expect a lot of words written in the next few days about his age.

But I think it's too late to turn back. Biden as nominee was inevitable, even if hindsight might give us pause to reconsider. But it is what it is and we have to make it work.

Won't turning the tables now split the party? And is there even enough time for someone else to prepare?

quote:

We can go with Harris, Whitmer, ptitzer. Doesn’t matter. Biden is too old and frail.

Jill needs to talk to him. Obama needs to talk to him.

I agree. The people around him need to step up and speak up.

quote:

But I think it's too late to turn back. ………

Won't turning the tables now split the party? And is there even enough time for someone else to prepare?

It’s not too late, but time is of the essence.

It won’t split the party if it comes from Biden himself.

Silly.

No matter how he did on the debate, would you change your vote to Trump??

No, I wouldn't. But ...

Biden is indeed old. It shows. It's true that he also had a cold and he was woefully ill-prepped, apparently.

But "I" don't make an election, and neither do you. An election is made by the 5-10 million persuadable people, plus turnout.

I'm watching elite opinion turn on a dime. Elite opinion doesn't make an election either, but on the center left (Biden's natural base) the shift seems palpable, as does the fear.

I'm afraid to say this, but the only thing that can possibly save us now is a major medical event ...

quote:

Originally posted by ShiroKuro:
It won’t split the party if it comes from Biden himself.

I agree with that.

quote:

No matter how he did on the debate, would you change your vote to Trump??

No, but it's not me I'm worried about.

This is indeed one of the major differences between the two parties today.

One is actually capable of reflection

@P*D, indeed.

Now, is the Dem Party capable of enough reflection to do the right thing and get someone else on the ticket.... Time will tell.

The mechanism for doing this is murky. We can't rerun a primary process, and throwing the decision to an open convention risks an unseemly squabble that rends the party into shreds.

Harris is the logical successor, but no one can simply anoint her. Biden can free his delegates and ask them to vote for her. Would he? Would he be advised to do that? She is unlikely to be the strongest replacement. People in the party know that, which is why an open convention fight could be ... counterproductive.

Thanks for this comment P*D...

You're right, there's no clear path forward to getting a different person on the ticket. It's probably not impossible, but the combination of logistical challenges, time, and lack of clear alternative person makes it seem unlikely.

I feel scared and hopeless.

One of my greatest fears is that Biden will have a health event in mid-Oct, or really any point after the DNC I guess, and then things will be thrown into complete chaos.

And you know who feeds on chaos.

This is one of those many reasons that Dems often have trouble with messaging/winning as opposed to serving with skill and honor...

Instead of supporting the best choice, now so many are running around in a panic!

if Biden can be persuaded to step down for the good of the country... if his closest advisors can persuade him that if he runs he is going to lose to DT and we'll all lose the republic....

then the convention can do what conventions *used* to do back in the day--it can pick the candidate. There is time, if he doesn't wait to bow out. Newsom, Whitmer, et al can get on the stick and start campaigning.

if he won't bow out, then there is nothing anyone can do. he won the primaries, he has the votes. If, at the convention, a faction of the party tried to remove him from the ticket, it would be chaos.

I would be happy with Whitmer, but the candidate I really want is Buttigieg. Maybe not this go-round, but in the near future.

quote:

Instead of supporting the best choice, now so many are running around in a panic!

Because he’s no longer the best choice. I am so afraid that he will have a health event before the election, and then what happens? The excuse this time was he had a cold. Well, next time it might be worse. What happens if he becomes unfit to run, or serve, before the election. Say on Oct. 29th? Many people will have voted early, but those who haven’t may stay home… it would chaos if his health were seriously compromised before the election.

What laws are in place to deal with that? It would be a disaster.

It may be a disaster in any case.

I agree with this NYT editorial. Now the question is, can the message get to the man who needs to hear it.

quote:

To Serve His Country, President Biden Should Leave the Race

Regular link:
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/0...on-debate-trump.html

Gift link:
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/0...L6twK&smid=url-share

And this one:

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/0...is-biden-debate.html

The ticket should be Harris for president, Buttigieg for VP.