My mom always said it is rude to invite yourself to something if you haven't been invited.

I think this point of view has become an endangered species.

My sister, being a Big Wig, gets two free tickets each year to go to a particular awesome tennis tournament. It's not "tickets" per se. It is a weekend in a warm resort location; lodging at a nice hotel; seats in the corporate suite for the matches; free food, drink, and hats; a tennis clinic with a teaching pro; usually a photograph with a tennis star. The event is held over the final weekend of the tournament, so tickets are hard to get if you don't have a "hook-up."

My sister and I went to this tournament a few times in the past at our own expense, often with our tennis buddies. A few years back, the group stopped going -- it was expensive.

Well, last week, one of the ladies who had gone twice with the group texted me and asked if I was going to the tournament and where I was staying. I said sis and I were going for finals weekend and staying at X hotel. Friend replied that she would love to go and wanted to know if we had extra tickets; she said she would also try to find some tickets to buy and maybe she could then sleep in our room on a blow-up mattress. I replied that I doubted that we could get extra tickets; that this is really sis' event because we are going as guests of the corporate sponsor; let me know where she is staying and where her seats are and we can grab a drink. Awkward, awkward, awkward. She has not replied.

: sigh :

I do not understand self-invitations. I have a friend whose husband is the coach of the U.S. kayak team, so she gets to go to every Olympics and lots of other cool places. I have never once asked if she could get me Olympics tickets or, god forbid, whether I could sleep on the floor in her room.

I suspect Facebook has something to do with self-invitations. You see others are doing something, maybe you are hurt to be excluded, I get it. But etiquette had this all worked out in the pre-Facebook era: Those doing the fun thing shut up about it in the presence of the Uninvited; the Uninvited pretended to be unaware that the fun thing was happening.

My friends who are hosting weddings say the Self-Invitation has become routine, with people flat-out asking to be invited and/or to bring additional guests. Me, if I don't get invited to someone's wedding, I do not self-invite; I consider it permission to spend the night curled up with the book and bottle of wine that I bought with the wedding gift money I did not spend on the happy couple.

I wish we could find a way to nip this -- why do folks want to go where they are, for whatever reason, not invited?

I can't answer your question (I would never dream of doing something like that!! What is wrong with people?? Good grief.)

But I did want to say
Hi Cindy!!

I think it depends on the closeness of the relationship.

If you were traveling to visit your sister, you wouldn't have any problem asking if you could stay with her.

If it were a mere acquaintance (which this might be), of course it's a problem.

Beyond that, there are exceptions. Your best friend has arranged to visit you for a weekend, and has already bought plane tickets. You subsequently get a party invitation. I don't see it as a particular problem to tell the host or hostess that you have a friend in town that weekend, and to ask if it would be an imposition to bring him or her.

In short, not cut and dried. It depends on the relationship, it depends on the situation, and it depends on how the question is phrased. "I assume it's OK if I bring a friend who's going to be in town?" would be presumptuous. "I know this could be an imposition, and if it is please tell me no, but is there any chance that I could bring a friend? He's going to be in town for the weekend, and I can't abandon him, but I'd really like to come to the party, too." is less so.

I was taught that the way to handle the situation Quirt describes (you accept an invitation, then learn friend will be visiting) is that you don't come out and ask.

You say, "Becky, I was really looking forward to your Cinco de Mayo party, but I learned that a college friend is coming to town and will be staying with me that whole weekend. I'm so sorry that I won't be able to make it this year."

Becky then either responds with, "Don't be silly! Bring your friend!" or "Oh, that is a shame, but I understand completely; we'll get together another time."

It seems fair to leave it to the host, right?

quote:

Originally posted by ShiroKuro:
I can't answer your question (I would never dream of doing something like that!! What is wrong with people?? Good grief.)

But I did want to say
Hi Cindy!!

Hi, SK!

I was super busy at work before the transition, then a business trip, then a personal trip (Miami Beach, Key West). So now I am back and looking forward to catching up with you all!!

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
I was taught that the way to handle the situation Quirt describes (you accept an invitation, then learn friend will be visiting) is that you don't come out and ask.

You say, "Becky, I was really looking forward to your Cinco de Mayo party, but I learned that a college friend is coming to town and will be staying with me that whole weekend. I'm so sorry that I won't be able to make it this year."

Becky then either responds with, "Don't be silly! Bring your friend!" or "Oh, that is a shame, but I understand completely; we'll get together another time."

It seems fair to leave it to the host, right?

Asking, while acknowledging the imposition and expressly indicating that a "no" answer would be acceptable, also leaves it to the host.

This seems to fall into a category commonly known as a "favor". It is not impermissible, in all circumstances, to ask for a favor.

In my old age I'm way less willing to share a hotel room with anybody but family, and the whole sleeping on a blow up mattress 3 people in a room thing would make me crazy, hotel rooms are too small for everybody's stuff as it is. So even if I was willing to part with some "free tickets", the friend would be on her own for a room. But I agree - you don't invite yourself, you say you are going and ask if the others would like to meet for a drink or dinner or something.

If you call it a "favor," then a self invite suddenly becomes ok? I guess I can ask about those Olympic tickets in a few years if I ask for them as a favor? : )

The line is easy to recognize. If you leave the unwilling host in a position to give a direct answer of no, then you have not done it properly. In the example I gave, Becky never has to tell me no. She only has to not accept my counter invitation. It's a no without the no.

I'm also not sure circumstance and relationship solves the problem either. The two people may have very different ideas about the nature of both things. Happens all the time and feelings get hurt.

I don't even knock on the neighbor's door if I know Don is there and they are having drinks.

I did text and ask whether I could join them once. I was welcomed. That was bold for me. Took my own drink, a ginger beer.

quote:

Originally posted by jodi:
In my old age I'm way less willing to share a hotel room with anybody but family, and the whole sleeping on a blow up mattress 3 people in a room thing would make me crazy, hotel rooms are too small for everybody's stuff as it is. So even if I was willing to part with some "free tickets", the friend would be on her own for a room. But I agree - you don't invite yourself, you say you are going and ask if the others would like to meet for a drink or dinner or something.

Want to hear about a Self-Invitation Backfire of sorts?

One of my tennis friends (call her Sally) is moving far away. I was her tennis captain for years; we partnered sometimes; we have the same group of tennis friends.

One day, another tennis friend (call her Karen) said to me, "Hey, are you going to Sally's going away party? Maybe we can car pool."

I responded, "What going away party?"

Karen, visibly embarrassed, said, "Oh, Sally was going to have a couple of people over in a couple of weeks. Just a small thing. She's probably still sending out invitations."

So I waited. No invitation. What to do, what to do? The idea that Sally would invite only Karen was odd -- Sally and I are actually closer friends than Sally and Karen, or so I thought. But it looked like I didn't make the cut. I said nothing to Sally or anyone else, and the date for the party came and went.

And about a week later, I found the invitation hidden in a stack of mail in the kitchen.

I called Sally and apologized for my failure to RSVP (I make it a point to RSVP promptly, so appearing to have ignored the invitation was unacceptable) and explained my error. She laughed it off, and that was that.

But still, what is the most one can do when one thinks there is a good chance one's invitation has been lost in the mail or there has been an oversight? I saw in an advice column that the most one can/should do is inquire of the person who spilled the beans about the party and ask them to contact the host to see. Like, "Hey, I was talking to Cindy and she didn't know about the party. Let me know if you want me to fill her in."

But under these circumstances, I did not feel comfortable doing even that. It would have been super embarrassing to learn that Sally didn't like me as much as I had believed.

I don't think there's a graceful way to inquire whether your invitation was "lost in the mail." This is one of those suck it up moments. I've been in exactly the place you've been, Cindy, with finding an invite after the event is over. All you can do is call and apologize profusely.

As for the self-invite, I do think it depends. I've definitely called to inquire whether I could visit family members over the holidays, for example, but making it very clear that a "no" is an OK response. I can't imagine trying to horn in on a friend's event, especially to the point of asking if I could sleep in their hotel room on a blow-up mattress. Ugh, ugh, no.

It puts one in the awkward position of saying, politely, "No, I'm a guest myself and I can't invite someone else along to an event that isn't mine." And shame on the other person for putting you into that awkward position.

Though, if I'm being honest, I would probably ask your Olympic coach friend how I could get tickets, with the hope that the coach might offer some of theirs. But even that is different than just flat out asking if they could get me tickets. Or maybe I'm deluding myself.

On the family member self-invite . . .

IMHO, there's really no reason for a self-invite there either. Just say, "Hey, family member. I'm thinking of coming to D.C. over the Christmas holidays. Will you guys be around -- we'd love to see you if you are!"

Then listen.

The reply will surely be, "Yes, stay with us."

But you might get instead, "Yes, we'd love to see you too!" If you get that response, you follow up with, "Awesome. Do you guys know any place where we can get a deal on a hotel?"

The host then will either say, "Don't be silly, stay with us!" or "I've heard good things about the Best Western."

Then you have your answer.

The reason I think one must tread gently even with relatives is because . . . just because. You never know whether the brother-in-law can't stand you. Or you were filthy and obnoxious last time and you are not welcome back. Or their marriage is strained right now. Or your dates are just too long. Whatever it is, if the relationship is one you value, then give folks a graceful way out so the relationship doesn't become strained.

On the Olympics tickets, my experience has been that I get invited plenty if I just sit back and wait for tickets to free up. Heck, I went to the U.S. Open Tennis for free two years ago when a friend became ill and could not use her tickets. But if I did decide to approach Ms. Kayak about Olympics tickets, the most I would do is say, "Kim, I'm thinking about going to the Olympics in a few years. I'm trying to decide what events tend to be the most fun -- do you have any advice?"

Back in the day, they called that "Dropping a hint."

Cindy -- recovering from decades of "Too Many Houseguests" syndrome from living in San Francisco and then D.C. for 30 years

Yes, "dropping a hint."

Maybe some people just have trouble saying, "No, sorry."

If friends were coming to San Francisco, I had no problem with them asking if they minded staying with us. If it wasn't convenient, I just said, "sorry, that's not a convenient time," and that was that.

Is it really so hard to say no if someone asks for a favor?

Does this "don't ask" rule apply to other kinds of favors? If you need a ride somewhere, are you not allowed to ask a friend? Should you just call them up and say "Hey, I bet you didn't know this, but my car's in the shop, and I really have no way to get to X" and then leave that hanging in the air?

Where exactly is that line drawn on favors, anyway? I seem to recall the prototypical favor in the 1950s, the decade of gentility, was walking over to the neighbor and asking for a cup of sugar or a couple of eggs. Or is that inappropriate, because you could just go to the supermarket and get some yourself?

Where's the line?

I've noticed this before, but this seems to be an issue of where the presumption lies. I assume that, if someone wants a favor, they'll ask. If they need a ride, they'll ask, and then I'll do it if I can. If they need a place to stay, they'll ask, and then I'll say yes or no. I don't offer gratuitously because I assume that, if they need a favor, they'll ask.

The other way of looking at it is that you can alert someone to your situation and then wait for them to offer to help.

Is it really out of bounds, according to Miss Manners, to ask a friend for a favor?

Allow me to give an example. Back in the day, when I was single and before my kids were of car-driving age, I occasionally needed to have a medical procedure done, like a colonoscopy. The doctors were all very clear that the procedure would not be done unless you had someone standing by ready to drive you home from the hospital. And no, a cab ride would not do ... they had to stay overnight, in case you woke up bleeding and had to be rushed back to the hospital.

In that circumstance, was I not supposed to call a close friend and say, "hey, I need a ride home from the hospital after my colonscopy, is there any way you can do that?" Was I supposed to call said friend and say, "I'll be getting a colonoscopy on X date, but that assumes I can figure out a way to get a ride home from the hospital, because unless I can get a ride I can't have the colonoscopy, thanks for listening, bye"?

Sometimes, you need a favor, and you have to ask, and I don't think it's a violation of good social mores to do so.