I wonder whether Amy Cooper thought of herself as a racist or gave vent to whatever implicit or unconscious bias she possessed when she was confronted about her dog.

The difference doesn't excuse what she did, but it might point to different reasons for her words and actions. Sometimes our presumed friends can be our most dangerous enemies.

Big Al

I feel confident she doesn't think of herself as a "racist." She said as much.

And few of us will admit to racism or even implicit bias, even to ourselves.

Asking again, could someone please provide me with a link to this encounter? Apologies if I just misssed it somewhere in this thread.

Google Amy Cooper encounter, it’s the first thing that pops up, there should be a video or two you can watch.

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
I feel confident she doesn't think of herself as a "racist." She said as much.

And few of us will admit to racism or even implicit bias, even to ourselves.

Isn't that sort of the point of implicit or unconscious bias. We harbor a bias that we can act on without even being aware of the motive behind our action?

Big Al

The question about whether it was a conscious or unconscious act is one that lots of people have asked. But it doesn’t really matter, because it was a racist act either way. Racism doesn’t have to be conscious. I found this video helpful - others might, too.

https://bigthink.com/videos/how-to-solve-racism

quote:

Originally posted by dolmansaxlil:
The question about whether it was a conscious or unconscious act is one that lots of people have asked. But it doesn’t really matter, because it was a racist act either way. Racism doesn’t have to be conscious. I found this video helpful - others might, too.

https://bigthink.com/videos/how-to-solve-racism

The message might be a good (I did not watch after the intro)

But this is from a white person...Not sure that will fly.

quote:

Originally posted by BeeLady:

quote:

Originally posted by dolmansaxlil:
The question about whether it was a conscious or unconscious act is one that lots of people have asked. But it doesn’t really matter, because it was a racist act either way. Racism doesn’t have to be conscious. I found this video helpful - others might, too.

https://bigthink.com/videos/how-to-solve-racism

The message might be a good (I did not watch after the intro)

But this is from a white person...Not sure that will fly.

The person in the video wrote White Fragility, which has been recommended as a good place to start for white people who are interested in doing the work. The video is about why white people have such a hard time confronting their own racism. I totally understand that we need to listen to Black voices - and I completely agree. But for white people learning to do anti-racist work - confronting our own whiteness is a crucial step. I think the video (and the book) are both worth a look.

Edited to add: If you need further convincing that the author might have something worthwhile to add, it is on a book list created by Ibram X. Kendi for people beginning an anti-racist journey https://chipublib.bibliocommon...204842963/1357692923

The Atlantic article: https://www.theatlantic.com/id...alph-northam/582580/

I experienced a FB surge on a coworker's page last night..lot of rage.. which I get but hard to have a dialogue....Memories of the Old Coffee Room.

I met up with him today to apologize to him masked face to masked face if my comments offended...His friends had piled on and I could not make head or tale of their stories. I had asked for them to tell me their stories but it just went down hill.

I wanted to personally apologize for anything I may have posted was offensive to him or inappropriate. He was amazing...we talked for a long time about his fear of walking through town.... How he is anxious about stopping at stop signs...We support him 100 percent but his day to day stress is real.

I told him of an experience I had just this week..I found pick up on my walk with its windows smashed out...It was early morning in a pandemic so I was not wanting to knock on doors...I called the police in hopes of finding the owner and making sure he was ok and knew about it. The cop approached me and said there was nothing he could do...the victim was to get a parking ticket...The cop actually told me that the truck owner had been harassed because he was a "brown person"..and yet the victim was punished...
.

This stuff is so hard for so many people. It is deeply engrained. An example.

Someone I know was talking about unarmed people who had been killed in police encounters. He told the stories of four black male victims, one after another, matter of factly. So far, so good.

But then victim number 5 was a white woman. His tone changed slightly, just a little extra sorrow. Then he Characterized her as a “solid citizen,” adding “not that the others weren’t.”

See what he did there? He implied that her death was somehow more tragic, her life more valuable.

Is he a monster? No. Has he had a lifetime exposure to the idea that black lives don’t matter and that white women are more precious and deserving of protection? Yup. Does he have an implicit bias that causes him to view victims differently based on race and gender? Apparently.

Will he learn from it? We shall see. But his written apology to the whole group after someone took him to task was, “I’d never value victims differently because I’ve spent my whole life working to protect vulnerable people.” What he should have said was, “I hadn’t realized that I thought that way, I regret what I said, and I’ll work on it.”

quote:

Originally posted by dolmansaxlil:
The question about whether it was a conscious or unconscious act is one that lots of people have asked. But it doesn’t really matter, because it was a racist act either way. Racism doesn’t have to be conscious. I found this video helpful - others might, too.

https://bigthink.com/videos/how-to-solve-racism

Fascinating. “Swimming in racism.”

I’d be interested to hear what you guys think about that video. I can’t possibly see it through your eyes.

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:

quote:

Originally posted by dolmansaxlil:
The question about whether it was a conscious or unconscious act is one that lots of people have asked. But it doesn’t really matter, because it was a racist act either way. Racism doesn’t have to be conscious. I found this video helpful - others might, too.

https://bigthink.com/videos/how-to-solve-racism

Fascinating. “Swimming in racism.”

I’d be interested to hear what you guys think about that video. I can’t possibly see it through your eyes.

I think it’s helpful if it will stop white people from going on defence the second race is mentioned. Understanding that the whole system is racist - not just guys in white hoods - is an important first step. Understanding that we can be well-intentioned but still racist is important, too.

I’m interested in your thoughts on it, Cindy, if you are willing to share them.

quote:

Originally posted by big al:

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
I feel confident she doesn't think of herself as a "racist." She said as much.

And few of us will admit to racism or even implicit bias, even to ourselves.

Isn't that sort of the point of implicit or unconscious bias. We harbor a bias that we can act on without even being aware of the motive behind our action?

Big Al

A bit like trying to predict unknown unknowns.

quote:

Originally posted by dolmansaxlil:

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:

quote:

Originally posted by dolmansaxlil:
The question about whether it was a conscious or unconscious act is one that lots of people have asked. But it doesn’t really matter, because it was a racist act either way. Racism doesn’t have to be conscious. I found this video helpful - others might, too.

https://bigthink.com/videos/how-to-solve-racism

Fascinating. “Swimming in racism.”

I’d be interested to hear what you guys think about that video. I can’t possibly see it through your eyes.

I think it’s helpful if it will stop white people from going on defence the second race is mentioned. Understanding that the whole system is racist - not just guys in white hoods - is an important first step. Understanding that we can be well-intentioned but still racist is important, too.

And understanding that the life they've managed to lead was undoubtedly possible because of white privilege. Not that they weren't talented, didn't work hard, didn't earn it ... but they faced fewer hurdles, hurdles they may not even have known about, because of their skin color.

For example, were there professors or teachers or bosses who treated me differently, gave me more leeway, were more willing to interact with me, because of my skin color? There is literally no way, looking back over more than forty years, for me to know. But it sure seems likely, in retrospect, even if I was unaware of it at the time.

I don't have any trouble acknowledging that I hold racial biases. I'm conscious of some of them. I try to avoid acting unthinkingly on those when I recognize them. What I have a very difficult time with is identifying biases that I am not consciously aware of.

I just went through an unconscious bias on-line training at the company where I still work on an hourly basis. I could understand some of the examples of biases and resultant actions, choices, or decisions that were presented, but there were a couple of the multiple choice questions where I got the "wrong" answer and, even when the "right" answer was presented, I still could not understand why it was correct.

I'm not all that adverse to criticism, particularly if I believe it will make me a better person. I understand the concept of white fragility, but I have a hard time applying it to me or my present situation. I try not to be defensive or dismissive if someone suggests a racist reason for something I say or do. I don't automatically agree with the suggestion, as sometimes the race (or religion, sexuality, or whatever) card is played to gain an advantage. If someone is willing to engage in honest dialog with me, I'm happy to learn more about how I might be harboring unacknowledged biases or prejudices.

I'll close this post with relating how uncomfortable I felt when I was in gay bars and clubs before some attitudes had changed. I particularly recall one night in south Minneapolis when I went into what appeared to been a neighborhood watering hole while I was waiting for a friend to return home. After ordering a beer, I noticed that those around me at the bar were all women who at first glance I had assumed to be men. I became nervous about being in a "dyke" bar, drank my beer, and left. I don't think in retrospect that I was in danger, but my discomfort was enough to make me not pause to order another beer. I think of this as an example of an unconscious bias being brought to consciousness, albeit without any input from those toward whom I was biased.

I don't propose to reintroduce the "some of my best friends are black (substitute whatever group you want here)" but from where I live and who I associate with, it's very difficult to get any honest feedback on what biases I harbor that I don't consciously recognize.

Big Al