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Calling All Lawyers: Shall we pick apart this Michigan federal lawsuit?
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Minor Deity
Picture of Cindysphinx
posted
Here's what I know about the Michigan federal lawsuit, which is part of the effort to hand the election to Trump on account of irregularities. Biden leads by about 146,000 votes.

Michigan law says that there are "poll challengers" and "poll watchers." Challengers have far more rights than poll watchers. Challengers must be registered voters in Michigan. They are allowed to inspect the machines while the polls are open, can challenge voters, can examine the voter books. They also have the right to observe the vote counting, but they may position themselves behind the inspector's table and may not interfere with the work. Michigan law also states that it provides penalties for "an election official or precinct board prevents a challenger from being present in the
polls or refuses to provide a challenger with any conveniences needed for the performance of his or her duties." The penalty for denying a poll challenger his or her rights is $1000 or 2 years in prison.

In contrast, poll watchers have almost no rights.

The Trump lawsuit is based on affidavits showing that designated challengers were denied meaningful observation as required by law and there was "derogatory language” used against Republicans poll challengers at the central location where Wayne County absentee ballots were tabulated. The lawsuit requests that Michigan’s secretary of state not certify the election results until we have been able to verify and confirm that the ballots that were cast were tabulated according to the law.

The grounds of the suit are equal protection. Since it's federal court, they have to state a claim under federal law. The idea is that Republican Poll Challengers were treated differently than Democratic Poll Challengers.

Now, I see a whole lot of problems here. First, you can't just walk into court and ask the court to stop someone from doing something. The Trump campaign would have to seek temporary injunctive relief, meaning they'd have to show they would suffer irreparable harm if Michigan is allowed to follow its normal procedures and certify its vote AND they would have to show they would likely win the lawsuit. That's a tough one. You can't just say one challenger was not allowed to stand somewhere or was cursed at, especially if you had other challengers there. You'd also have to show the Dem challengers were treated differently for no good reason.

There's also the problem that a federal court would normally want the state court to decide matters of state election law, which is how it went in Bush v. Gore. There, the Supreme Court did not get involved until after the Florida Supreme Court had ruled. No federal court waded in and stopped the vote count before that happened.

Also, the Trump campaign says it wants an opportunity to inspect the voting machines. Well, that is something that state law deals with, and that's kind of what the vote certification process is all about. The counties go back and double-check everything to catch errors. So why shouldn't that process be allowed to play out?

It's odd that they are going after Michigan. That is the state where Biden has the biggest lead. AZ = 16K; GA = 10K; PA = 40K; WI = 20K.
 
Posts: 19763 | Location: A cluttered house in Metro D.C. | Registered: 20 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Minor Deity
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OK, found more information.

There are two affidavits online.

First, a poll worker claims she was told to put an incorrect date on batches of ballots that were about to be sent to voters. Not on ballots that voters sent back -- ballots that Michigan was sending to voters.

Second, a poll challenger says he was watching the count on election day and saw something. He says he tried to shift position to get a better visual on the poll book on the computer screen and the mail-in envelopes. He was then scolded for not social distancing by standing at least six feet away from the election official. He protested, saying he couldn't see to verify the eligibility of the voters' ballots. This, even though he had been able to stand closer at other precincts like Lansing and East Lansing. He then left the room to fill out a challenge and call a lawyer. He then learned that no new poll challengers would be allowed in the room and he was not allowed to re-enter. Michigan law says the election official has the authority to expel challengers from the room.

The excerpts of this affidavit to not reveal whether there were other Republican poll challengers there. And . . . of course there had to have been.
 
Posts: 19763 | Location: A cluttered house in Metro D.C. | Registered: 20 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Cindysphinx:


It's odd that they are going after Michigan. That is the state where Biden has the biggest lead. AZ = 16K; GA = 10K; PA = 40K; WI = 20K.


From the WaPo, here’s why they are focusing on Michigan:

quote:
Perhaps the greatest opportunity for Republicans to try to upend the vote certification process lies in Michigan, where a four-person state canvassing board made up of two Democrats and two Republicans is responsible for certifying the state results. If they deadlock, the decision could fall to the Republican-controlled state legislature.
 
Posts: 45738 | Registered: 20 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Minor Deity
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If Michigan goes to Trump and PA stays Dem, Trump can’t win without flipping GA and AZ.

One difficulty with the Steal Michigan plan is the Michigan commission and legislature would have to make that bold move without knowing the final vote count in AZ. I cannot imagine Michigan officials will attempt what may be an unsuccessful steal.
 
Posts: 19763 | Location: A cluttered house in Metro D.C. | Registered: 20 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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There are any number of state election officials who are not happy about charges of corruption.

Look to them to snarl any attempt at invalidating election results in their respective jurisdictions.


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Life is short. Play with your dog.

 
Posts: 34929 | Location: Hooterville, OH | Registered: 23 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Minor Deity
Picture of BeeLady
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@bradheath of Reuters pulled several of the statements and posted them on Twitter. Pretty weak not to mention pretty hillarious...for example..

"Many stacks of ballots that appeared to be in pristine condition, as though they had never gone through the U.S. Postal Service." Blink

Observer Statements in Mich.


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"Wealth is like manure; spread it around and it makes everything grow; pile it up, and it stinks."
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Posts: 11215 | Location: Massachusetts | Registered: 22 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Minor Deity
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And here is a pic of a Republican Poll Challenger who claims she was denied the opportunity to observe. Note the mask below the nose:

 
Posts: 19763 | Location: A cluttered house in Metro D.C. | Registered: 20 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Curse


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Life is short. Play with your dog.

 
Posts: 34929 | Location: Hooterville, OH | Registered: 23 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Minor Deity
Picture of BeeLady
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Oh, it gets better. There are some who are on court proceedings and Tweeting blow by blows...This is a short summary.

Ya can't make this stuff up.... From Maricopa County, AZ


--------------------------------
"Wealth is like manure; spread it around and it makes everything grow; pile it up, and it stinks."
MillCityGrows.org

 
Posts: 11215 | Location: Massachusetts | Registered: 22 April 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Has Achieved Nirvana
Picture of wtg
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Not sure if this is the same lawsuit as Cindy posted about originally.

Michigan throws out a case.

quote:
"Plaintiffs rely on numerous affidavits from election challengers who paint a picture of sinister fraudulent activities occurring both openly in the TCF Center and under the cloak of darkness," Kenny writes, noting that those claims were "decidedly contradicted" by an election expert put forth by the defense.


quote:
In a not-so-subtle slap on the wrist, Kenny suggested the challengers should have attended the training session in October, so they could have known what they were witnessing during the counting process was standard practice.

"Regrettably, they did not and, therefore, [those who filed affidavits] did not have a full understanding of the … ballot tabulation process."


https://abcnews.go.com/Politic...mp/story?id=74199110


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We are all visitors to this time, this place. We are just passing through. Our purpose here is to observe, to learn, to grow, to love… and then we return home. - Australian Aboriginal proverb

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Posts: 37884 | Location: Somewhere in the middle | Registered: 19 January 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by Steve Miller:
Curse


+1
 
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    well-temperedforum.groupee.net    The Well-Tempered Forum  Hop To Forum Categories  Off Key    Calling All Lawyers: Shall we pick apart this Michigan federal lawsuit?