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Has Achieved Nirvana |
I saw a couple of articles that highlighted some interesting results from a Cleveland Clinic study of the effectiveness of the bivalent vaccine. It was published at medRxiv recently, so it hasn't been peer-reviewed yet... The weird results (text quoted is from the study, not any articles):
Study participants were on the young side, and there were more than 50,000 people in the study. If you're interested in wading into the weeds, here's the whole study: https://www.medrxiv.org/conten...2.17.22283625v1.full
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Does This Avatar Make My Butt Look Big? Minor Deity |
Thanks. This affirms the decision I already made about further vaccines: I am done. | |||
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Has Achieved Nirvana |
I found a pretty balanced article that summarizes the results of the study, for those who don't want to plow through the details. https://sanduskyregister.com/n...ions-about-boosters/ Wise words from Eric Topol:
For me, the Cleveland Clinic study is just one more data point to be considered in a broader context. Other things I'm interested in include how the vaccine protects people in my age cohort; study participants are much younger than I am and we know COVID affects people differently depending upon age. And I'd like to see more data on protection against severe illness or death. And, just for good measure, a look at whether vaccines and/or Paxlovid provide protection against long COVID. Throw in my individual risk profile (prior reaction to vaccine but otherwise excellent health for someone my age) and it gets fairly complicated. The journey continues.
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Has Achieved Nirvana |
From someone in the medical sciences field, in the late 60s age cohort:
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Has Achieved Nirvana |
I was sick for a week. Then took asthma drugs steadily for three weeks because breathing was difficult. Had not been taking precautions. I did not die. Snowshoed uphill for most of a mile yesterday. Downhill went faster. Expect to ski tomorrow.
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Has Achieved Nirvana |
Mary Anna and I picked each contracted COVID (with a bonus case of strep throat!) over our Christmas trip to Arizona. We've both had the bivalent vaccine. The combination of the two infections was less than fun, but it wasn't as bad as the worst cases of flu that I've had. However, a week and a half later, we are both still feeling the aftereffects. There's also the complicating factor that the new COVID strain is somewhere between 40 and 70 times more likely to evade immunity/vaccinations. Who know how that affects the protection you get from vaccines and whether more shots lead to less protection. I don't think we've had enough experience yet with the new strain to be able to reach conclusions. | |||
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Beatification Candidate |
This is important to me. Given my recent diagnosis of COVID infection while I was hospitalized for other reasons and my current vaccination status (original two vaccinations plus one booster), I discussed what my best strategy should be with the doctors providing my hospital care. The general consensus was that since I had had COVID in the recent past without any significant symptoms, I probably had a fairly high level of antibodies and that it would be best to delay receiving the bivalent booster for at least a couple of months. That is the advice that I intend to follow unless new information of a fairly definitive nature emerges in the meantime. I do think that the commentary from the person in the medical sciences field makes very valid points that may not have been fully recognized in the population of the study. Big Al
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Has Achieved Nirvana |
Friend sent me this WSJ link. I think it's a gift link that bypasses the paywall. Let me know if it does/doesn't work for you. https://www.wsj.com/articles/a...share_mobilewebshare Seemed to be some things worth considering, but I could have done without the editorial/political commentary, things like:
I need to go back and look at the individual studies that are linked to in the article; the Cleveland Clinic study is one of them but there are several others that looked pretty interesting.
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(self-titled) semi-posting lurker Minor Deity |
I finally got the bivalent booster, and it ended up being about year after I got the previous booster. (Is that right? I need to look at my notes.. covid-era time is wonky in my brain) Anyway, despite having gotten the shot, I continue to take more precautions than most people I know. We didn't travel during the holidays. We did attend one social function. I kept my mask on almost the whole time, expect when photos were taken and when I had a quick bite to eat. Also, the weather was nice and some windows were open. So the comment WTG quoted above about the relationship between vaxxing and behavior makes a lot of sense to me, and I would imagine it is incredibly hard to design a study that would measure those kinds of connections. Anyway, this semester I have all kinds of activities going on and I'm planning to travel and attend in-person conferences for the first time since Feb 2020. And I'm planning to see my mother in person for the first time since 2020 as well. I don't want to have miss seeing her because I get sick. And I don't want to get sick. And I don't want to have to miss any of these events. So, I'm going to keep masking and taking as many precautions as I possibly can. We'll see how it goes. As for the vax, I already got the bivalent booster, but whether or not I get the next one offered will depend a lot on what we learn in the next 6 months or so...
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(self-titled) semi-posting lurker Minor Deity |
Oh one more thing WTG said I wanted to comment on. Yes, I want to know about long covid and all those details. Is the vax helping prevent it? I don't think we know yet, right? WTG, did I miss anything about that specifically in those links you posted?
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Has Achieved Nirvana |
I've seen some articles regarding studies on the possible effect of vaccines and Paxlovid on long COVID, but I didn't do a deeper dive to look at the studies themselves. IIRC, there are some indications that both the vaccine and Paxlovid may help reduce the occurrence of long COVID. For some reason, numbers in the 15 to 30 percent reductions in long COVID stick in my brain, but I'd have to go back and find those articles to confirm that. I haven't posted any links to that information that I can recall, and certainly not in this thread. If I find something worth reading, I'll post it.
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(self-titled) semi-posting lurker Minor Deity |
Thanks! Re the percentage reductions … I know we don’t know the number is. But let’s say it’s 15%. I wonder how compelling a 15% reduction in risk is…
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Has Achieved Nirvana |
It's a bit of an "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin" question, unfortunately. 1) We don't know what percentage of people go on to get long COVID. 2) We don't to what extent vaccines and antivirals affect the chances that you'll get long COVID. 3) Most importantly, we don't have a universal definition of what long COVID is. Kinda affects 1) and 2). In theory it's something I'm interested in knowing about. But practically speaking, I don't think it's something we will have much information about soon.
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Has Achieved Nirvana |
From a year ago, but a pretty interesting discussion about vaccine adverse effects, long COVID, etc. https://www.science.org/conten...symptoms?cookieSet=1 It just highlights the complexity of the science. We are not going to have answers for years. I'm amazed at how much we already know.
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"I've got morons on my team." Mitt Romney Minor Deity |
This is going to sound like I'm dissing people for "accepting" or "believing" this study, but whenever I hear the term "multivariable analysis" in a study of this sort my eyes start to roll and I prepare to hear folks talk about their biases being confirmed. Sorry, but "analyses" of this sort establish NOTHING but weak correlations. It's not quite as bad as "increases in ice cream consumption causes drownings to rise," but this is the kind of medical research that often gives "science" a bad name. | |||
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