Oh come on, if I got drunk off my ass and fell asleep in a drive thru line causing enough disruption that the restaurant called the cops, they’d give me a break because I was white?


I got an actual dui conviction in my early 20s being a lot less disruptive than that.

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:
But he wasn’t out of range when he shot it, at least not in any way that would be obvious to the cop. So again, you’re effectively saying ‘a cop needs to smile and say cheese when the pero aims the taser’. Really, that’s your standard.

he was out of range when he shot it. Based on my read of the video.

But even if he wasn’t, once he shot, you see a lot of distance open up between them as the cop slows and draws his weapon.

That is the point at which you assess the force: what was happening when the force was used? You had a guy running full out with his back turned, and an officer definitely out of taser range.

No threat justifying deadly force.

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:
Oh come on, if I got drunk off my ass and fell asleep in a drive thru line causing enough disruption that the restaurant called the cops, they’d give me a break because I was white?


I got an actual dui conviction in my early 20s being a lot less disruptive than that.

He didn’t look or sound drunk off his ass to me.

No, I do not think you would be arrested. I don’t think most well run agencies would want their officers to make that arrest, either. Not when you have the alternative of parking the car, citing, and letting him walk. Now, if they ran him and saw prior drunk driving, that’s different.

Are you really going to tell us all that your white skin doesn’t advantage you in police encounters?

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
We’ll never know, Jon.

Cause the cop would never have decided to arrest you in the first place.

I can tell you the real reason we’ll never know, Cindy. When I was Mr Brook’s age and failed my roadside sobriety test and the cop cuffed me (all of which happened), I cooperated.

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
Are you really going to tell us all that your white skin doesn’t advantage you in police encounters?

The data suggest that white skin makes a suspect more likely to get shot by a cop while unarmed but less likely to get rough treatment of a lesser sort (‘hands on’) than a black suspect.

quote:

a cop should knowingly accept a taser hit without pulling his weapon”. I mean, you gotta own that

I already pretty much said exactly that, did you miss it?

But again, more than that, Mr. Brooks was running away, with a “weapon” that becomes quickly useless the further away you get.

I did miss it

One more point, Jon.

What we really have here is retaliatory force. The officer shot in retaliation for this guy having shot a taser at him. The cop knew he was at no risk from the taser once the darts missed and once the distance increased.

He was just mad.

I’m not sure about your stats on cops shooting so many unarmed white people. Do you have a cite? Shoot don’t shoot studies show that officers are slower to shoot an armed white person, and quicker to shoot an unarmed black person.

I’m sorry the Wendy’s burned, but, well. It seems the only way to get the attention of our leaders is to burn something. I don’t condone it, but I understand it.

Jon, this was a few pages back.

quote:

Originally posted by ShiroKuro:

quote:

Do cops have to take a taze?

Yes. If we're going to let them get away with tasing people to extent that they do, then yes.

Having said that, this is not the main question for me.

This is the main question for me:

quote:

we've traditionally allowed cops to escalate force to whatever point necessary to subdue their attacker *if* they or another person are facing imminent threat of death or severe injury.

Someone who is running away is not an imminent threat.

Roland Fryer at Harvard has spent years studying it.

The popular press reports it the other way around but they’re comparing police shootings to overall population rather than criminal population.

I watched the video..I saw a man's survival instincts kick in..he was impaired..He was very far from officers by the time they fired.

They could have just let him run..they had his car! It was no surprise who he was..they could have let him run it out, sober up and get back to him later. And that they chose this even NOW shows horrible judgement.

Shooting a man (in the back) while running for his life because he was drunk? NOT good enough...So where do you draw the line? Do you shoot when your registration is expired? Cause you barf on the cops shoes?

What is the line here? Where has the line for justifiable force gone?

I am old enough to remember the honor a cop had when they retired...They would brag about how they had NEVER discharged their weapon during their entire career...

Fear based training has a part in this.

My blood is burning.

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:
Roland Fryer at Harvard has spent years studying it.

The popular press reports it the other way around but they’re comparing police shootings to overall population rather than criminal population.

you realize that who is deemed the criminal population is itself soaked in racism, right? That there has been selective enforcement in policing for decades? If you patrol black areas, harass black peoples, and criminalize black drugs but not white drugs, the measure you are using is already tainted.

You can’t measure racism using a yardstick dipped in racism.

quote:

Shooting a man (in the back) while running for his life because he was drunk?

I never get these types of comments. He was shot because he assaulted the officers and shot his taser at them. Whatever one thinks of the justification, the causal chain is pretty clear.

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:

quote:

Shooting a man (in the back) while running for his life because he was drunk?

I never get these types of comments. He was shot because he assaulted the officers and shot his taser at them. Whatever one thinks of the justification, the causal chain is pretty clear.

Wow..Did you watch the video? He pointed it from far way (didn't really point but hold his hand out backward as he fled) but I did not see it fire..He was well far from causing harm to the cops. And it was a tazer, NOT a gun.

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:
Roland Fryer at Harvard has spent years studying it.

The popular press reports it the other way around but they’re comparing police shootings to overall population rather than criminal population.

you realize that who is deemed the criminal population is itself soaked in racism, right? That there has been selective enforcement in policing for decades? If you patrol black areas, harass black peoples, and criminalize black drugs but not white drugs, the measure you are using is already tainted.

You can’t measure racism using a yardstick dipped in racism.

Of course, but some numbers are more trustworthy than others.

I would never compare drug bust rates across racial categories, for example. No question black kids in bed stuy get more marajuana busts than the white kids in Scarsdale.

But murder and other violent crime? Those you can confidently compare, since they are not ignored in any community (even if the crimes aren’t solved, we know they’re counted).

So yeah, those numbers are pretty trustworthy.