The Trump team did not have to agree to the debate so early in the cycle.

Then when Biden botched it,they kept piling on.

And now the Dems get to flip the script after the Republicans already played up the age issue.

If you’re Trump, what’s your next move?

Cindy — thinking Harris should not agree to debate until the polls settle down

Unless the polls flip, Trump has already laid the groundwork for pulling out of the debate.

Dems need to be prepared to hammer as hard and constantly as they can on the "he's too scared and too old" theme.

Republicans already thinking they blew up pick. They went with energizing their overenergized base instead if tacking to the middle.

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:
Unless the polls flip, Trump has already laid the groundwork for pulling out of the debate.

Dems need to be prepared to hammer as hard and constantly as they can on the "he's too scared and too old" theme.

Won't work. They were more than willing to put up an even older candidate until they were losing. To hammer on age simply continues to remind voters of their hypocrisy, certainly among independents.

They need to nominate someone with sizzle. All Kamal has is a long record of fizzle.

quote:

Originally posted by Mikhailoh:

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:
Unless the polls flip, Trump has already laid the groundwork for pulling out of the debate.

Dems need to be prepared to hammer as hard and constantly as they can on the "he's too scared and too old" theme.

Won't work. They were more than willing to put up an even older candidate until they were losing. To hammer on age simply continues to remind voters of their hypocrisy, certainly among independents.

They need to nominate someone with sizzle. All Kamal has is a long record of fizzle.

No, they were more than willing to put up an even older candidate until it became apparent that he was in decline.

The fact that they were willing to ditch a beloved but older President because he clearly wasn't ready to be President for the next four years was a sign of patriotism, not hypocrisy. The hypocrites are the ones who ignore the fire hose of nonsense and lies that come out of Trump's mouth.

JD Vance has thoughts about women who do not have kids. A few years ago, he called Harris a childless cat lady and said she doesn't have a stake in the future of the country because she doesn't have biological children.

Seven Lessons from the Biden Presidency

Jonathan Last (from the Bulwark)

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:

quote:

Originally posted by Mikhailoh:

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:
Unless the polls flip, Trump has already laid the groundwork for pulling out of the debate.

Dems need to be prepared to hammer as hard and constantly as they can on the "he's too scared and too old" theme.

Won't work. They were more than willing to put up an even older candidate until they were losing. To hammer on age simply continues to remind voters of their hypocrisy, certainly among independents.

They need to nominate someone with sizzle. All Kamal has is a long record of fizzle.

No, they were more than willing to put up an even older candidate until it became apparent that he was in decline.

The fact that they were willing to ditch a beloved but older President because he clearly wasn't ready to be President for the next four years was a sign of patriotism, not hypocrisy. The hypocrites are the ones who ignore the fire hose of nonsense and lies that come out of Trump's mouth.

In my view you are mischaracterizing pure power politics as nobility. He was forced out. The entire nation knew or suspected his infirmities long ago, and Democratic leadership certainly did.

It's a shame. I always liked Biden and I think he is a good man. But this decision was forced on him.

quote:

Originally posted by Mikhailoh:
The entire nation knew or suspected his infirmities long ago, and Democratic leadership certainly did.

I don't think that reflects the reality of the situation. The entire nation knew he was old, but a huge number of Democrats considered him able. The only people I read saying he was unfit were some columnists at the NYTimes and WaPo and Mr Hur, and in hindsight it's clear they knew things we didn't. It's only since the debate that people saw the truth, and that has allowed hindsight to illuminate earlier events and behavior. No. No hypocrisy here. Mr. Trump has never been "able". One thing you can say for Democrats is when they see the truth, they don't allow others to tell them they didn't see. Gaslighting doesn't go over well on this side of the aisle.

quote:

But this decision was forced on him.

Insofar as Biden would not have stepped down if no one had pressured him, that's right. Force was needed to get Biden to accept the truth that the debate and hindsight had changed too many people's minds.

Bernard is correct. I, for one, didn't realize the extent of his decline.

I think "force" is the wrong word. He was pushed and persuaded, but he ultimately made the right choice. I'd compare it to Trump after the
"grab 'em by the p****" comment. The entire party tried to force him out. Look how well that worked.

Mik, I don't know why you won't acknowledge the hypocrisy of Republicans who said that Biden was too old, but ignore the fact that Trump is in obvious decline as well and is bats*** crazy and a congenital liar on top of that.

Put me in the "didn't realize how bad he was" camp.

Some indications were there but I'll confess to wishful thinking and trying to minimize, even ignore, what was happening. Having been through cognitive decline with family members I know it's an easy trap to fall into. You just don't want to believe it's true.

But the debate brought the decline front and center and impossible to ignore. And his appearances after the debate have been mixed, but that's the way things go. I know for certain they won't improve over time.

I'm guessing there are people who view Trump very differently than they did when he came on the political stage in 2015. Me, I've thought he was a dangerous, egotistical buffoon and liar since the beginning, yet millions jumped on his bandwagon and elected him in 2016. I could never understand why they didn't see what I saw.

Over time, Trump continued the behavior I thought was insane and I think a lot of people have come to the same conclusion I have. That shift is why he didn't win in 2020 and why so many people are agonizing in 2024. I don't think that's any more hypocritical than coming to a belief that Biden isn't up to another four years. Rather it's a sign of mature thinking, being able to change your conclusions in light of additional information or further reflection.

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:
Bernard is correct. I, for one, didn't realize the extent of his decline.

I think "force" is the wrong word. He was pushed and persuaded, but he ultimately made the right choice. I'd compare it to Trump after the
"grab 'em by the p****" comment. The entire party tried to force him out. Look how well that worked.

Mik, I don't know why you won't acknowledge the hypocrisy of Republicans who said that Biden was too old, but ignore the fact that Trump is in obvious decline as well and is bats*** crazy and a congenital liar on top of that.

Who said I don't acknowledge that? It's the flip side of the Dems now saying Trump is too old.

quote:

Trump is too old

Trump has always been incoherent and shown signs of disorders and sloppy thinking. That may be getting worse as he gets older, I have no idea. But the reason for being anti-Trump is not because of his age but bc he’s a threat to democracy, the country and the world.

We should all keep tightly focused on that.

I think the GOP did overplay their hand. They figured that Biden was going to lose, he was vulnerable on many issues and people don't like him (if they are pro-Trump). Picking Vance, who is now basically Trump's Mini Me, didn't help at all.

People on the fence are not happy about Project 2025, another hand overplayed.

Women are not happy with Roe v Wade - overplayed.

And even some of the die hards may start to realize that Cannon's dismissal of the classified documents case (where trump IMO is beyond obviously guilty) is a double-edged sword, as it's being used to dismiss the lawsuits against Hunter Biden as well - overplayed.

They also appear to have been rocked back on their heels with Biden's leaving the race. All of their "sleepy Joe" talking points are now moot.

This will be interesting, for sure.

The freak out continues. They’re trying to impeach Harris.

https://thehill.com/homenews/h...icles-kamala-harris/