Just to watch it die.

https://twitter.com/cnn/status...-toSefgdnrs8VlDTCruQ

Page has been taken down.

It just worked for me.

It's still working for me too. But here's a direct link to the story on CNN.

https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/02...pregnancy/index.html

Yes, the Twitter link is working now. And I read the CNN article. Sad and maddening.

The anti-abortionists I know would not be affected by this news story.

Not people I would choose to break bread with ...

So heartbreaking. And so unnecessary!

No kidneys is not a gray area.

This is an example of why I don't necessarily trust health care professionals-- they too often make self-centered, fear based decisions like this one.

quote:

Originally posted by Daniel:
No kidneys is not a gray area.

This is an example of why I don't necessarily trust health care professionals-- they too often make self-centered, fear based decisions like this one.

Oh, but did you read down to the story about Jamie Herrera Beutler’s baby, born with no kidneys? A lot of medical intervention there, and then a transplant from the father. So it’s not impossible to survive, just improbable. (JHB was a local Republican lawmaker here. She got primaried by the Trumpies.)

I guess you could call that a gray area? Not very likely for most people, but not impossible.

For a family that couldn’t afford to travel out of state for an abortion, most likely impossible.

quote:

I guess you could call that a gray area? Not very likely for most people, but not impossible.

For a family that couldn’t afford to travel out of state for an abortion, most likely impossible.

Yeah, I would not call this a gray area. And yes, I did read the article.

But in the case of JHB, there were so many things that had to align just perfectly. In my mind, this is another reason why these types of decisions should be between the doctor and the woman (not that you were saying differently, AM).

To take these one in a million cases and use them as reason to establish a wholesale ban on abortion is wrong.

quote:

Originally posted by Nina:
But in the case of JHB, there were so many things that had to align just perfectly. In my mind, this is another reason why these types of decisions should be between the doctor and the woman (not that you were saying differently, AM).

To take these one in a million cases and use them as reason to establish a wholesale ban on abortion is wrong.

Exactly.

quote:

Originally posted by Nina:

To take a...one in a million cases and use [it]...as reason to establish

...ANY law.

(Thinking too of the keynote speakers on the anti-abortion trail, people who have somehow survived attempted abortions - even early ones and go on to broadcast their joie de vivre.)

Likewise, for that matter - typical of well-off wingers - who rationalize eliminating basic safety net provisions on the basis of the one in a million unfortunates who somehow manage to survive or even thrive against all odds.

You know, that business of pulling oneself up by ones bootstraps and applying it as a standard for the vast majority who don't even have boots.

There's something about many/most "self-made" wealthy people which leads them to completely deny the role of luck in their (anyone's) success. I'd say that's a trait that also leads them to becoming Republicans.

Note, personally, I also include in such instrumental luck, the mental health and nurturance of the parents they're born to - probably more important than their circumstances. At least one of the parents.)

quote:

Originally posted by AdagioM:

Oh, but did you read down to the story about Jamie Herrera Beutler’s baby, born with no kidneys? A lot of medical intervention there, and then a transplant from the father. So it’s not impossible to survive, just improbable.

Personal Edit: Not just "a lot of medical intervention", but a super lot of financial facilitation. Even a law-maker (the mother) reported three hospitals they appealed to, wouldn't even return their calls about the risky experimental procedure. Cost and affordability (by the parents) surely factored in the baby's eventual survival.

The kidney-less baby must have had to be on delicate dialysis from birth until years later when it underwent a kidney transplant (from its father) which itself must have been a super expensive procedure, besides which there will almost certainly have to be subsequent transplants as she grows.

How many parents of gestating infants with this rare condition could afford all such care?

It's an extremely complex ethical decision (entangled with financial issues), and it certainly does complicate legal arguments pro-con abortion under such circumstances. In a way, it's like the complications pro-con abortion engendered by the increasing number of babies surviving after birth at very early gestational ages. Every such surviving child moves back the legal age of permissible abortions, for those who oppose abortion.