So we are pretty close to getting a sump pump installed (close as in, we've had a few basement waterproofing contractors out, one more to go).

But I'm wondering if there's anything we need to be thinking about that we're not?

We have half basement, half crawl space. The plans we're getting is to dig a ditch (for lack of a better word) in the crawl space along each wall, down below the footer?? Line the ditches with gravel and have it feed to a sump pump, which will then be piped out into the yard. I believe, as I understand it.... Separate from the sump pump we're doing stuff on the outside of the house to help keep water away from the house as well, so as WTG has said elsewhere, we recognize that it's a multifaceted approach...

Anyway, I've been thinking, what are the risks of that kind of construction? Like, risks to the foundation of the house I mean.

The company we like the best was recommended to us by a co-worker who's sister had her basement done by them, and they seem to be well-regarded locally.... And this is supposed to a lot cheaper and less disruptive than work on the outside of the house (like, excavating the foundation and resealing???)

But I wonder if there's something we're missing??

Anyone have any experience with retro-fitting a sump pump? (which is basically what this would be)

What is prompting you to install inside drain tile and a sump pump in the crawl?

Also, why are you skipping the basement?

quote:

What is prompting you to install inside drain tile and a sump pump in the crawl?

So, we get water in the basement that comes from the crawl space side, and the idea is that the sump pump should help prevent that? (plus, I've never lived in a house with a basement but not sump pump, so it seemed like the right thing to do...

In all seriousness, we didn't contact the "basement waterproofing" companies and say "pls install sump pump" -- instead, we've had them come out and tell us how they think we can solve our problem, and they are mostly all saying the same things.

quote:

Also, why are you skipping the basement?

What do you mean? What would we do that would be not skipping the basement?

I thought I understood that the inside drain tile and sump are going in the crawl only, and that you aren't doing anything in the basement.

My experience is with single level areas. In our vacation home, we only had a crawl under the house. Here in Chicago, it's all basement. All the water problems we have had are with water forcing its way in at the wall/floor joint when the water table got high. That's why I asked about "why the crawl and not the basement" question.

What kind of guarantee do they give (if any) that what they recommend will solve the problem?

Probably best I not try to give advice on this one. I have no idea how your lower level is set up (where the crawl is relative to the basement proper), what the grading looks like outside, or where the water problems are.

Hmm.. so let's see if I can explain this. The house sits on a slope, and around here (for houses this age), it was very common to leave half of the basement not dug up (bc of expense I believe). So we have a walk-out basement with concrete floors and walls (one room is actually finished with proper walls and ceiling) and on the opposite side from the walk out, there's a wall with a "door" at the top. You have to get on a ladder to go through it.

On the other side of that wall is the crawl space. And on that side (the side closest to the basement side) the height is basically the same as the basement side, but the ground slopes up pretty quickly so that by the middle of that space, you can't stand upright.

So the idea would be to have those drains made along each side of the crawl space, but for the drain along the wall that the crawl space shares with the basement, that drain would be below the floor level of the basement side, and the sump pump would be installed there as well. Water that comes into the crawl space will be funneled into those drains and then to the sump pump.

Water doesn't come into the basement from the walk-out side, so this should solve the problem, according to the basement solutions guys...

The house I lived in while growing up was a split level that had a sump pump in the crawl which was on the same level as the basement. I believe the idea is that the crawl doesn't have a solid concrete floor, so the water will enter there before working up to through the basement floor. The sump should work to keep the water a few feet below the surface of the floor.... as long as the electricity stays on and the pump stays working!

We lived in one house where there was new construction next door with a very deep basement - the sumps they put in worked pretty much year-round... Must have been pretty close to the water table for the area!

quote:

The house I lived in while growing up was a split level that had a sump pump in the crawl which was on the same level as the basement. I believe the idea is that the crawl doesn't have a solid concrete floor, so the water will enter there before working up to through the basement floor. The sump should work to keep the water a few feet below the surface of the floor....

The contractor did indeed say something that makes me think it's the same basic idea, that the sump pump should get water from the interior drainage system and also from ground water...

So, how are sump pumps and the exterior drain kept clean??

quote:

as long as the electricity stays on and the pump stays working!

I believe there's an option for a battery back up system, I'll have to ask how much that costs.

Because, when there's a lot of rain, those are the times when power outages are more likely!

We never had problems with the sumps getting clogged. I remember the hose to the yard had some issues in the winter getting frozen in some freak rain then cold snaps, but I remember my dad making the outlet pipe bigger to allow it to drain before freezing.

My mom is still in that house - I've replaced the pumps (the addition got another pump) once or twice over the years as they've failed.

When I lived in a house with this problem, we put in French drains *outside* the house along the foundation. The idea was to keep the water from entering the crawlspace at all, if possible. The sump pump only came on in the spring, when the water table rose higher than the exterior French drains could handle.

In the house we are in now, the previous owners installed French drains around the exterior of the foundation. There is no sump pump--we're atop a hill so the water drains away--plus this is a much drier climate.

I am not familiar with your local conditions so can't really answer your question. I would rely on the local contractors--especially if they are agreeing with each other on what to do. I've never heard of French drains being inside the crawlspace. I would think it would be better to drain the water away outside the house rather than allowing it to come in before getting rid of it. But they must have a good reason for doing it this way where you live!

I don’t know anything about your local conditions and I know even less about sump pumps. That said, one of the things I like about the house in Ohio is that there is no sump pump. Instead, the fact it’s built on a hill allows the French drains to “drain to daylight”. No worries about power failures.

If that’s a possibility for your application I’d certainly consider it.

Following up on pique's point...on interior vs exterior French drains:

https://www.puroclean.com/blog...hich-system-is-best/

In an existing home I think many people go with interior drains because they don't want to dig up their landscaping and/or they have decks, patios, or other hardscaping that make excavating next to the house difficult or impossible.

Our house has exterior drains (original from 1960) that empty into a sump pit in the basement. We used to get seepage from the wall/floor joint during even moderate rain events. We are fairly certain that some of the clay drain pipe (what they used in 1960) has collapsed. We installed a DIY above floor interior system maybe 20 years ago. There was no way to do anything on the outside. We already had a sump pump that is connected to the exterior system and we just connected the inside above floor system to the existing sump pit.

We eventually installed a battery backup pump for power outages; we did it ourselves. And like ron, we've replaced sump pumps as they've died.

When we sold our vacation house last year part of the deal was replacing the existing sump and adding a battery backup. I also got pricing for both conventional inside French drains and also the same above floor system I linked to above, but installed by the waterproofing company.

Talk about sticker shock. Their pricing for the Seal Once above floor system was totally crazy - between $50 and 69 a foot. Retail price on the material is about $6 a foot. Installation involves a bead of epoxy on the floor, then sticking down a piece of plastic channel; no real skills involved. It wasn't much cheaper than the jackhammer-the-floor-put-in-gravel-and-drain-pipe option. I was very surprised, probably more so because I knew the materials cost of the above floor system and what's involved in installation.

We still had to bite the bullet and pay their exorbitant fee for installing the new primary and backup system. Thank goodness we didn't have to do anything with drain tile.

piqué,

quote:

I would think it would be better to drain the water away outside the house rather than allowing it to come in before getting rid of it.

Yes, that's what I've been thinking. But I haven't ask any contractors this question in exactly this way... One more contractor is coming this week, so I'll ask them, and I have a running list of questions for the one that was here last week, so this is getting added to that...

As for french drains, there are some around the outside of the house, that apparently the previous owners never even cleaned. None of them seem to be working as intended.

But one thing that's super frustrating is that (so far anyway) no single company/contractor does all these tasks: the ones who do basement waterproofing say they don't do the outside drains (although they will run a new drain out from an installed sump pump). The contractor we had here said they "could" do it but they recommended we contact Roto-rooter instead because RR has the camera thing and can blow out the drains (with jet/water pressure) and then use their camera to inspect the insides... So needless to say, we've added RR to the list of contractors to come out... -_-

BTW:

quote:

I would rely on the local contractors--especially if they are agreeing with each other on what to do.

This is a good point! The company that came on Friday also offers a 20 year warranty on their work, which say a lot IMO.

quote:

Instead, the fact it’s built on a hill allows the French drains to “drain to daylight”. No worries about power failures.

If that’s a possibility for your application I’d certainly consider it.

Steve, our house is built on a slope, so the walk-out side of the basement is lower than the crawl space side. If we want water that enters the crawl space to not get into the basement (finished side), I think pumping it out is the only solution.

Of course, that's a separate question from "how can we prevent water from getting into the crawl space in the first place."

So maybe the other question is, is there any outside solution (french drains etc.) that will truly prevent water from entering in the first place? If the answer is no, then we want the interior drains + sump pump solution. And we still probably want to do all the preventative measures on the outside as well....

Reading WTG's comment, one other comment about the solution that the basement contractors suggest: I think part of the reason for doing it this way is because the crawl space is dirt, not concrete, and so it's easier to add those interior drains...

Gonna go read WTG's links now...

When you build a house on a lake and in the middle of the woods like we did, humidity/moisture are a problem. Our crawl space in the vacation home was concrete, which is why we considered the SealOnce system. The space with a concrete floor was a lot easier to dry out with a dehumidifier. Other people had just dirt or gravel (very humid) or they covered the dirt/gravel with plastic to trap the moisture.

A basement or a crawl has the potential to act like an inground swimming pool that refills naturally from the water table below. If that's where your water is coming from, the only thing you can do is to catch it in drains, direct it to the pit, and pump it out. And, of course, make sure grading is correct so as much water as possible drains away before it can percolate through the soil near the house.

Our water came from below during seasonal rises in the water table due to spring snow melt. Sump pump ran like crazy for three weeks, and then pretty much never.

A few years ago as the lake level rose to near-record levels that we had never experienced before, the water table did too. The floor of our crawl was basically below the level of the lake. The sump pump was running constantly all year 'round the year we sold it. We were basically trying to keep Lake Michigan out of the crawl.