quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
Steve was talking about expulsion, not prosecution.

For expulsion, knowledge of the wrongs is irrelevant, in my opinion.

Again, that's what I said. But I know you want to disagree with me, so go ahead.

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:

quote:

Originally posted by Steve Miller:
Does it matter? They shouldn’t be there.

Throw them out.

Yes, it matters. Because the ones that knew were accessories to crimes.

They should all be expelled. The ones who knew should be charged, with their parents.

I agree.

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
Steve was talking about expulsion, not prosecution.

For expulsion, knowledge of the wrongs is irrelevant, in my opinion.

Again, that's what I said. But I know you want to disagree with me, so go ahead.

So you’re saying the ones who knew should be expelled.

And you’re saying the ones who didn’t know should be expelled.

So for purposes of expulsion, can you explain your statement that the student’s knowledge of the wrongdoing matters?

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:

quote:

Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
Steve was talking about expulsion, not prosecution.

For expulsion, knowledge of the wrongs is irrelevant, in my opinion.

Again, that's what I said. But I know you want to disagree with me, so go ahead.

So you’re saying the ones who knew should be expelled.

And you’re saying the ones who didn’t know should be expelled.

So for purposes of expulsion, can you explain your statement that the student’s knowledge of the wrongdoing matters?

I'm pretty sure I don't need to explain it. I'll bold the part that pertain to expulsion, in case it was unclear.

quote:

They should all be expelled. The ones who knew should be charged, with their parents.

Perhaps your misunderstanding pertains to the issue of expulsion. I was not limiting myself to that issue. Because, in discussing the wrongdoing of the kids, Steve asked, "Does it matter?" And I said, "Yes, it matters", and proceeded to explain why it mattered.

I wasn't aware that I was required to limit my discussion of why it matters to the subject of expulsion.

Dr. Dre is very pleased that his daughter got in on her own.

I'm sure his $70MM donation a few years ago had nothing to do with it.

https://people.com/music/dr-dr...Q0DaRQgFucA3R9gEFVaY

I saw that this morning. Clueless.

Editor of Yale's student newspaper says Yale has expelled the beneficiary of the scandal who got in...

Student Expelled

Just when I thought all that could be said about this had been said, there comes this interesting piece in the NYT.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/0...help-themselves.html

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:
Just when I thought all that could be said about this had been said, there comes this interesting piece in the NYT.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/0...help-themselves.html

That's a very interesting take, and rings true in many ways.

quote:

Originally posted by QuirtEvans:

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:
Just when I thought all that could be said about this had been said, there comes this interesting piece in the NYT.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/0...help-themselves.html

That's a very interesting take, and rings true in many ways.

Not sure if I agree.
The calculus may be as simple as being a "spoil kid with an unearned job in the family business WITH A DEGREE FROM A NAME-BRAND COLLEGE" is still better for the kid than being a "spoil kid with an unearned job in the family business WITHOUT A DEGREE FROM A NAME-BRAND COLLEGE." In that sense, the parents are still doing it for the kids.

The point is, depending on the kid's priorities, the name brand college may not make a difference.

Someone like Olivia Jade may very well better off going to (I won't insult anyone by naming a particular school, just call it Generic Non-Flagship State University With a Large Study Body and an Excellent Football Team) than by going to USC. She can skate by at Generic State U., just the way she did in high school. And she clearly has no plans to do anything with a college degree.

There may be kids who really want to go to a more name-brand school, or who will likely do something with a college degree. For those kids, the analysis would be different. But this article seems particularly relevant for Olivia Jade, and I imagine there are others in her situation ... they plan to do whatever, they'll have a very large inheritance on which they can rely, and they have no particular ambition.

quote:

(I won't insult anyone by naming a particular school, just call it Generic Non-Flagship State University With a Large Study Body and an Excellent Football Team)

Thank heavens, that leaves out my alma mater, despite what Olivia Jade's parents said.

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:
Just when I thought all that could be said about this had been said, there comes this interesting piece in the NYT.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/0...help-themselves.html

I don't find this article that surprising. Of course the parents did this for bragging rights. We are talking about parents who have already decided to use their power, money and influence to push their kids into all sorts of places they were unlikely to have gotten on their own. Do you think this is the first time the parents interfered? I don't. What makes this sad for me is the notion that these parents are so overbearing that they've simply not allowed their children to be individuals, have their own successes and failures.

Re: Olivia Jade, for example--becoming a "brand," with a significant following and a contract with Sephora is not a trivial accomplishment. Had the parents been even vaguely interested in their daughter, the person, they would have encouraged her success in that direction, which she clearly was good at and interested in.

Wow, I love Caitlin Flanagan.

Read this. The opening is about her own time as a guidance counselor at an elite LA prep school. Then she goes into specifics about these cases that you may not have heard yet, providing her own commentary along the way.

Entertaining and interesting throughout.


https://www.theatlantic.com/id...l&utm_campaign=share

Great article.