BTW, were any of your quotes from a national chain like Home Depot, Lowes, or what else is there? Menards? is that national?

quote:

Originally posted by ShiroKuro:
BTW, were any of your quotes from a national chain like Home Depot, Lowes, or what else is there? Menards? is that national?

Mine were all regional. I picked for quotes the guy my realtor referred me to, the company that got the best local yelp reviews, and the largest HVAC company headquartered in Reno, with the biggest local reputation. The guy who won the bid actually works under the umbrella of Climate Pros, but I don’t think that really means anything. Steve would know better but it strikes me as a sort of a franchised name. As far as I’m concerned, I’m relying on the individual who bid the work, who I have excellent references on from my realtor and two others.

And yes, there are definitely regional price differences. This would’ve been higher in Los Angeles. But the differences should be all in the labor not the equipment.

As I say, we shall see. I may be relaying horror stories to you after the work is done this week. Or Steve may logon and point out some idiotic aspect of what I am doing…

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Originally posted by Doug:
For comparison, I'm having a Rheem unit installed tomorrow for about $4,500.

Is that for both a new furnace (indoor air handler if it is a heatpump system) and a new outdoor condensing unit?

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Originally posted by Steve Miller:

quote:

Originally posted by Doug:
For comparison, I'm having a Rheem unit installed tomorrow for about $4,500.

Is that for both a new furnace (indoor air handler if it is a heatpump system) and a new outdoor condensing unit?

Yes, if I’m reading this right. As I alluded to earlier this is not an area I have a clue about. But they are replacing the outdoor condensing unit and the indoor air handler. And all three vendors giving quotes said something about my heat pump system, whatever the hell that is.

Incidentally, the unit I’m replacing which does still work is a 1986 rheem. I believe it’s Seer rating is -4…

$4500 is a good price for that work, and about what I hope SK is able to pay. I don't know labor rates in her town but have a hard time believing they are higher than in the OC.

I had a Rheem system on this house for 25 years and only had one repair - about $300. I'm a fan.

quote:

Originally posted by ShiroKuro:
I don't understand why the ductwork should cost as much as the new equipment.

That ductwork number is about 4X what I would expect to pay for a simple installation like yours. Let's see what the other bidders have to say.

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$4500 is a good price for that work, and about what I hope SK is able to pay.

Me too!!

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That ductwork number is about 4X what I would expect to pay for a simple installation like yours.

Ok, good, then my initial reaction to that quote was not off!

Yep, very anxious to get some more numbers!! Fingers crossed.

Ok, got quotes from the local company, all Lennox made. The most expensive one is a variable capacity, variable speed air handler, the second one down is a two stage capacity, variable speed air handler and then the last two are single stage with high efficiency blowers. The difference between the two bottom ones is that the least expensive one (option #4) is smaller (?) and a little less powerful, and noisier than option #3.

I have to do some reading of course, and there's one more company coming out today. And I need to decide if I want to get a fourth estimate from some where, and I need to decide what I think about Lennox vs. Rheem, and whether I want to choose a maker or go with whatever company recommends....... I kind of had in my head $6000, so these numbers do look better, but now I have Doug's price as the standard, so...

Oops edited to add the quotes (the first price is with financing, the second price is if I pay it all upfront, if I wanted to pay by CC i have to add 3%)

20 SEER $10,836, $10,136
16 SEER $8,385, $7,785
15 SEER $5,980, $5,580
15 SEER $5,735, $5,335

Prices include installation, which includes: New equipment pad, connect to existing duct system, line set and condensate drain, all parts, labor, sales tax, start‐up, 10‐year parts and compressor warranty, 1‐year labor warranty

These numbers look more like I would expect, and of the choices the $5980 system is probably the one I would choose.

Does this company offer only Lennox equipment?

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Does this company offer only Lennox equipment?

No she said they could do American Standard (same as Trane) or ... I forget the other one. But she said they get a special deal on Lennox and they pass those savings on to the customer. But she said if I wanted to consider other makers she’d get me quotes, the implication was that the deal might not be as good

Oh, there are some rebates involved too but I didn’t include that info here b/c I still have to pay this price, the rebates come back a few months down the road.

Ok, company #3 came out today (and spent forever!)

Now I wait for their quote, but I'm guessing it's going to be high... (They install only Trane)

One thing I'm worried about is that the local company isn't paying enough attention to the duct work and the fact that the current set up is jerry rigged to pull air from the main ducts into the basement, and there's no air return in the basement... The other two companies have kinda gotten inside my head on that subject and now I'm worried about it.
Local company is recommended a 3 ton unit, same duct work.

Today's guy gave me a load calculation of 3.2 tons, said they don't make a 3.2 unit so I would have to buy 3.5, and then need to make some changes to the duct work in order for the system to work properly (e.g., get good air flow in all the rooms)

Anyway, we'll see what kind of quote they come back with.

This is way harder than choosing paint colors.

So have you gotten any more bids?

And while we’re here, has your circuit breaker panel been replaced?

Steve,

Re the quotes, I still haven't gotten any numbers from the company connected to Lowes. Both that company and the one connected to HD said they want to come back and look at the ducts again. HD gave me a ballpark number but no info on what unit that would represent, and the Lowes guy hasn't given me any numbers at all. I think I'm going to contact them both and ask for more info before agreeing to have them come out again.

Also, I'm trying to decide whether, or maybe how, to ask the local company about the quote they gave me, and their load calculations etc. The Lowes guy is telling me the load calculations say I need a 3.2 ton unit to include heating/cooling in the finished half of the basement, but they don't make a 3.2. ton so he's recommending a 3.5 ton, and then saying that would require modifications to the duct work.

So, I don't want to do that, I think it's going to be too expensive etc. At the same time, part of me is thinking that I would like to hear confirmation from the local company that a 3 ton unit (what they are recommending) will be sufficient. I'm wondering if the guy from the local company didn't spend enough time when he was actually there considering all those things, whereas the other two companies were in the house for 2ish hours and asking a lot more questions etc.

Another part of me is thinking, I don't want to ask because then I'll set myself up for a more expensive set up that I probably don't need.

Re the circuit breaker, the seller had it replaced before closing (thank goodness!)
I have some other little things I'm going to have an electrician do(not the electrician who changed the panel), so when he was at the house, I had him look at it just to have a true 3rd party's eyes on it, and he said it looks good. Whew!

If the house has gotten by with a 3 ton unit for the last 50 years then it will likely get by with a 3 ton now. A 3.5 ton unit might cool the house a bit more quickly. But:

An idea you might like would be to put aside the difference in price between the two systems and use the money to make energy efficiency upgrades over time, particularly at times when your local utility is offering rebate programs. Those programs are usually a great deal and pretty much anything will offset .2 tons in a 50 year old house.

Maybe consider attic insulation first. Blown-in attic insulation is cheap ($hundreds, not $thousands) and, depending on how much insulation you have now, the payback is nearly instant. Ditto attic ventilation - either powered, solar or whirlybird type.

Cheaper yet is to spend a Saturday sealing things up. A couple tubes of caulk, a few door sweeps, some peel and stick foam and some weatherstripping for the doors. This sort of project is well within the ability of the average guy and makes a big difference not only in the utility bills but also the comfort level inside the house.

Plant a deciduous tree on the south or west side of the house (not too close!) and you'll easily make up for .2 tons. Shades work too - either roll down bamboo type (check HD for "Coolaroo") or the more permanent metal type.

Finally, watch for rebates on new windows. It's a more expensive project but they don't all have to be done at once. Going from what you have now to dual pane vinyl windows is will make a surprising amount of difference, or at least it did in my house. Even though I replaced the weather stripping on my old windows before I replaced them the electric bill dropped some $150/month in the summer we installed them. We pay more for power than you do but the payback is still there and old windows are a PITA.