steve i agree with you about the european cars. very expensive to own.

lisa you should read the CR car buyers guide. i have used it for decades and it has never "steered" me wrong.

Wow you guys are harsh! But I appreciate the feedback...I want to know what I'm getting into.

Hopefully I can address everything in one post.

Chas - there is a newer Kia soul that I kind of like, but even though it is push to start, insurance on it is still crazy high. Some insurers won't insure Kias at all anymore -- I tried shopping our policy and a lot of companies wouldn't even take us due to the Kias. And on top of that, I'm really honestly quite angry at Kia - they cheaped out by not putting engine immobilizers in the cars they sold in the US (Canadian cars from the same model year have them because Canada requires it!) and then they buried their heads in the sand when the trend began and it took several class action lawsuits and finally insurers refusing to insure Kias so people couln't buy them anymore to finally get them to do anything about it. So I am trying to stay away from them.

As far as fixing our current Kias (both of which only have about 66K miles on them and run like champs!), they have had the "fix" that Kia recommends, which is basically gluing in the ignition column so that it can't be pried out and hot wired. But that doesn't do anything from keeping someone from breaking the window and trying, which means my steering column and window will be all jacked up. And parts to fix the windows and ignition are backordered for months because of everyone whose car has been attempted but not successfully stolen. Having a mechanic put in a kill switch won't solve that either. You're probably right that letting it get stolen might be the best financial deal, but I can't afford another claim on my insurance -- they're already dinging me for two hail claims (same storm, 2 cars) and the tractor-trailer fuel tank incident so I'd be doomed if my car was stolen. Plus a lot of times, stolen Kias are recovered, after kids joyride them and mess them up, and then that's just more hassle. So that's why these cars have to go.

For LL#2, we have looked at the Crosstrek and the Impreza hatchback (which is the exact same car as the crosstrek, only lower). LL#2 does not want an SUV so he likes the Impreza better. We can take our time with him because he won't need a car til summer at the earliest. Mr. Lisa has a Subaru now that has been very trouble free and our neighbors have (and have had) several that have gone well into the 6 figures on the odometer with very few issues. So we are pretty set on Subaru for him - there aren't a lot of choices for AWD that aren't SUVs.

Funny you all mention mazda - the Mazda 3 was on my list until I actually drove one. The VW dealer also sells Mazdas so we were able to compare them head to head. The Mazda 3 seems to be the smallest model Mazda sells other than the Miata and it is still rather large -- much bigger than the Kia. From seeing them on the road I thought they were smaller and the sales guy confirmed that they got bigger in recent years. The hatchback version has these wide body sections next to the back window which gives it a unique look but REALLY cuts down on the visibilty, and overall the colors, the interior, and the driving experience of the Mazda wasn't nearly as nice as the VW for the same price....the new ones kind of felt like an "old person's car" -- in fact, we both compared it to a Buick. (It probably didn't help that the car was the fugliest shade of KHAKI I have ever seen!!! Which is apparently a fancy limited edition color called Zircon Sand and the only color the model we preferred came in. Mazda's product designers should hang their heads in shame for that one!) So we ruled them out. All the other Mazda models seem to be large SUVs.

I have checked on the forums - I'm on Mini and Golf GTI forums on both reddit and facebook. Everyone seems to love their cars to death -- I don't seem too many complaints. I know several people with Minis in person and they all love their cars. I know one guy with a GTI who also loves his car. I do know that older minis (pre 2015) had issues but BMW took over in 2015 and since then, the reliability ratings have shot way up. And as far as Consumer Reports goes, I haven't seen the Car Buyers Guide, but I did run across the most recent CR Owner Satisfaction Survey where Mini has actually jumped up to #2 (behind only Rivian?!). (VW, alas, is second from the bottom....ooof! But discussion of this report on the GTI forums seems to indicate that this is the owners of the OTHER VW models -- GTI people are all happy as clams!) Looking at that report, I was afraid of a bias effect that people who have dropped $$$ on a prestigious named car would say they love it just to mentally justify the purchase, but then I noticed Mercedes and Audi getting trounced and Infiniti is bottom of the barrel, so hopefully that's not a thing.

My mechanic says stick with Asian cars (but not Kia/Hyundai) and says stay away from Ford and Chevy at all costs. A family friend that is a mechanic says yes to Mini but no to VW. So opinions are all over the map. The VW we looked at had a 7 year 96K mile bumper to bumper warranty (certified pre owned) so that negates some of my mechanical concerns with the VW. The Mini has it's bumper to bumper til October and then another year of limited powertrain-and-other-expensive-stuff type warranty. So both are at least under warranty for a while in case there's anything major.

Oh, I have looked at Honda Fits - haven't driven one but a local dealer has a bright yellow one that caught my eye. My minivan is a Honda and its fine, but I was hoping for something a little more zippy and fun - I think this is my mid-life crisis car, LOL. LL#2 actually really likes the Honda Civic, but being that he's in snow country we are pushing him to get AWD. Although given Rochester has had very little snow in the past few years (thanks climate change!) he may end up with a Civic after all.

Hopefully that addresses everything you guys brought up - let me know if I missed anything!

for zippy and fun, how about a mazda miata?

I kinda want a back seat and enough cargo space to manage a decent costco run. I don't think the Miata has a back seat or a hatchback style. They ARE cute though - there was one in the dealership when we were looking at the Mazda 3s.

(I also wonder what the insurance would be like on a sportscar like that with a 20 year old boy on the policy -- I bet it would be rough!)

Lisa,
Wish you had not told me the reliability of the Mini was much better. I like them.
Thanks for the info about Kia.
Hope you find something you like.

then i vote mini-cooper.

A woman in Moab kept her bicycle in the back of her Mini. I think she had to take the wheels off to do that. It must have plenty of room for a Costco trip.

I have a 2015 mini, bought new in 2014. It is good and reliable. Just don’t buy one earlier that 2015, because that is when BMW took over and improved it.

Still, I wouldn’t advise it for your kid. It’s small and the safety rating is not great, unless that has improved since I bought.

Wait, is the car for you?

If so, go drive a mini. Didn’t want one until I test drive.

Just for the record, I don’t think Honda Fits (what we have) are “fun” or “zippy” … But wow do they hold a lot!

We bought our Fit in 2015 and then filled up the car to near bursting and drove across 6 states when I finished my PhD. Then, last summer, we filled it up again and drive across 5 states when I took my new job.

Also, I remember that OT said you can fit a full sized piano action in the back.

So there’s that.

quote:

Originally posted by piqué:

quote:

Originally posted by jodi:
My son swears by his Subaru Cross Trek (or however you spell it).

i was going to suggest this, too.

Subarus are very reliable. Love my Outback.

J

Whatever car you decide on, think twice about getting these three car features: electronic instrumentation, turbo, and sun roof.

Sun roofs: Leaking and rattling are the two most common problems. Other problems include glass breakage and electrical problems with the roof’s motor. Also in the event of a rollover accident, a glass sun roof isn’t going to help save you. Don’t get a sun roof unless working on your sun tan lines is important to you.

Turbo: Turbos provide extra zip but it’s one very expensive engine part to replace/repair. At least $1500.

Electronic instrumentation: They look high-tech and spacey but they can be buggy. Because electronic dashboards are computer controlled, it’ll be expensive to replace it if necessary. Analog instrumentation is more reliable.

I have a 1984 Nissan 300ZX Turbo. Bought it new and although it’s 40 years old I’ve only had two problems with it: the turbo and the electronic digi-dash. I will never get a turbo charged car again. Electronic instrumentation? These days, it looks like all cars will soon have digi dashes if not already because it’s the digital age.

Some auto makers offer 10 year warranties: Kia, Hyundai, and Mitsubishi. Avoid special edition models such as convertibles and anniversary editions. They might have different parts from than the regular model and those parts can soon become NLA (No Longer Available). If you get a gas only model, it’ll most likely have a AS&S (Automatic Stop and Start) feature. It’s a gas saving feature. It works like this: When you come to a stop such as a traffic light, the engine shuts off automatically. Stepping on the accelerator pedal automatically starts the car back up again. Many people don’t like the feature and disable the AS&S feature but it’s only temporary and not permanent. Temporary meaning the AS&S is disabled for one and only one stop/start cycle.

Another vote for the Subaru Cross Trek here. I really wanted to buy one of their hybrids but they don't have their hybrid acct together right now. Mini Coopers get horrible had mileage, are expensive, and lousy in the snow.

I wouldn't touch a VW with a ten foot pole after they were caught lying for years about their mileage and emissions.

I second Steve's recommendation about looking at used Lexii. They have great customer service and their cars just run. If we hadn't already purchased our RAV4 prime, the NX whatever pehc would be on my short list