quote:

I'll evaluate the risk/reward tradeoff and make my choice.

As will I, but right now I’m very concerned about the process. And I wouldn’t put anything past Trump, he’ll do anything if he thinks it will help him get re-elected.

So your comments about each lab working on it, those will be the kinds of thing I want to follow up on.

Right. I will do what I always do: Read, investigate, question, and decide.

But let’s remember that there have been terrible injuries to people from drugs, drug protocols, and medical devices, and many were associated with major, reputable companies.

The problems are not necessarily with the companies themselves. The weak link can be the regulatory review process coupled with the financial and political incentives.

In other words, a “warp speed” development process means the normal safeguards won’t be in place because time wasn’t allocated for them. That has to be dangerous.

I cannot imagine a situation where these issues will be resolved to my satisfaction.

Now, I recognize my considerable privilege. My only risk factor is age. I will be unlikely to suffer any financial hardships. I can work full time from my kitchen for the rest of my life.

There is almost no benefit to me from taking the vaccine sooner rather than later.

Imagine that the Covid vaccine is like the flu vaccine. If it is 35-60% effective, that doesn’t help me. I would still feel like it wasn’t safe to eat inside at a restaurant, fly on a plane, throw a big indoor wedding. And that’s assuming the vaccine causes no long term harm, which we won’t know because of the rush.

I would far prefer they take the time to do this right.

The hunt for a vaccine is a global one, so I don't buy the notion that Trump, or his administration, can have a significant impact on its development. Distribution and cost? For sure. I'm in a watch and wait mode, personally. But if a vaccine is out there, it will take a significant discovery of medical malfeasance for me not to take it.

Even if it's only partially effective, that works for me. My view has always been that the lockdown, social distancing, etc., has been a way to buy us time until a vaccine appears.

I think we also need to just get used to the fact that the virus itself isn't going away for a long, long time. In other words, I see masks in our future for quite some time, even when we're back to "normal," whatever that is. The new normal most likely has masks.

quote:

Originally posted by ShiroKuro:

quote:

so many people who are vaccine compliant have no faith in this effort

That would be me. And, in addition to all the other vaccines, I get a flu shot every year etc.

But I want to be confident that any Covid vaccine isn’t going to harm me. I hope that by the time there’s a vaccine, and I actually have access to getting it, that I will feel confident in it.

Right now, I’m worried about the process and have zero confidence in anything with Trump’s fingerprint on it.

I have zero faith in the current US administration, and I do believe that there’s a reason new treatments take time. However, a vaccine is tested waters with variations. In other words, they know how vaccines work. They know what it takes to make a successful vaccine. They successfully are able to come up with variations on a vaccine every year to deal with flu. They are taking what they know about vaccines and applying it to something new. Worst case scenario is that it’s not as effective as vaccines for things like chicken pox, which they’ve had longer to create. But there isn’t a lot of evidence that (non-live) vaccines harm people other than them being less than 100% effective. Since I’m being forced into the illness cesspool that is a classroom in September, I’ll take a vaccine the second I can get it - even if it only has a small chance of being effective.

Most of the people in this group are not going to have access to the vaccine any time soon.

Putting aside the fact that every country in the world will want their share ...

Medical personnel first. First responders second. Teachers third. Essential personnel fourth.

Even those of us who might be higher risk need to wait our turn, because we aren't (and shouldn't be) the highest priority. Some of us are retired, others of us work from home or can structure out lives to be more socially distant.

I'm guessing it isn't an issue for this group (people like Dol not included) until the second half of 2021 or more likely 2022, because of other people who will need it more and will have a prior claim.

As far as whether it's safe or not, we'll have a very good perspective when we know if medical personnel are willing to be vaccinated. Anyone who can watch medical personnel around the globe gladly get vaccinated and still claim that they have doubts about the safety of the vaccine ... I'm sure I don't need to say any more.

I may be in front of a class next month ...

quote:

Originally posted by jon-nyc:
...the people who refuse the vaccine are consigning themselves to eventually getting it.

If so, one would hope that the statistics showing this is true, would persuade even the anti-vac hold-outs to cave in.

(That said, they haven't AFAIK yet been persuaded that polio, smallpox, measles, pertussis and tetanus vaccines work. At least, to judge by the one stringent hold-out with whom I'm acquainted. )

quote:

Originally posted by Piano*Dad:
I may be in front of a class next month ...

As may Mary Anna, but I'm imagining that most universities will get realistic as the time approaches.

The irony is that the rich and powerful would normally be expected to get the vaccine before the commoners. That's how it was in the early days of testing, remember?

But I think the rich and powerful will be the most likely to refuse the vaccine. Why risk a vaccine when you can live in a luxurious bubble in whichever one of your homes is not in a hot spot?

For those who are interested in a vaccine, Moderna P3 trials are starting soon. 87 locations, probably one near you.


https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2...aw=2&rank=2#contacts

I would have seriously considered trying it but immunosuppression is an exclusion criterion.

After you. I am simply being polite.

Well, I just told my mom today that after Labour Day we can’t see each other because I’ll be back at school with at least 20 8-9 year olds, no masks, no PPE.

Dol, I’m so sorry.

But, no masks?? Why not?

quote:

Originally posted by dolmansaxlil:
Well, I just told my mom today that after Labour Day we can’t see each other because I’ll be back at school with at least 20 8-9 year olds, no masks, no PPE.

Better see her lots, now.

quote:

Originally posted by ShiroKuro:
Dol, I’m so sorry.

But, no masks?? Why not?

They aren’t requiring them for students. And the board has determined that since we will stay 2 metres (just over 6 feet) away from all the children at all times, staff don’t need PPE. I’m not sure how I stay 2 metres away from 20+ 8/9 year olds in a classroom, but that’s what they’ve decided.